Why Nast Support Cleveland: In His Own Words

The following article is an interview with Thomas Nast about his decision to support the Democrat Grover Cleveland. Read the article and answer the questions at the end.

Some tips for reading a primary source:

• Look up any words or people you don't know
• Write down any questions you have to bring to your whole class.
• You may need to read it more than once to catch points you missed the first time

**This article was written in 1887 and contains language that is harmful, offensive, or misrepresentative. Due to the nature of the historical materials, there may be occurrences of language, positions, and values that do not align with MHHM's current values and practices. When harmful, offensive, or misrepresentative language is supplied by the creator of original archival materials, it is recognized as best practice to retain such information so as not to censor or alter the historical record and to maintain an understanding of the context of creation.

Why Nast Supported Cleveland: In His Own Words

Article Transcription, The Mail and Express, New York , Monday, May 30, 1887

Fickle Thomas Nast.

How He Changed from Republican to Mugwump.

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An Interview with the Artist in the Wilds of Florida--How he Came to Make the Famous Tweed Cartoons.

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Thomas Nast has had an interview with a reporter of the Jacksonville, Fla. Morning News. “You are not busy as late with your pencil,” observed the Morning News.

“No; my physician Dr. Howe, ordered me to stop work. I don’t look like a sick man and don’t feel so, but the hard work and constant strain of the last campaign exhausted my nervous system, and I found that nothing would do but a rest.”

“In the meantime I am doing only some light work-revising some of my pictures of old times and occasions for the Harpers to bring out in book form.”

And then before he could be asked about the pictures, he went on:

“Oh, yes I am having a real loaf. I’ve been up in Canada this winter to the carnival.”

“Did you try the toboggan?”

“Yes, I tobogged.”

“And went snowshoeing?”

“Yes, we went hunting for caribou on snowshoes, and had a great time. It is not so very difficult a feat to walk in snowshoes, but running in them is very different.”

“You said you were preparing some pictures for publication in book form?” inquired the Morning News.

“Yes, I’ll give you some points on that that have not been published yet, if you want them.”

“I am, indeed, interested,” replied the Morning News. “I have often wondered that this has never been done. As it is, no one can get your war pictures nor those famous Tweed cartoons, except by purchasing bound volumes of Harper’s Weekly for the years in which they appeared.

“The first of these books,” said Mr. Nast, “will be a Holiday Book, for which I am preparing the various Santa Claus and other Christmas and holiday cartoons which I have made at different times. These I am selecting and arranging, and the book will be out some time next fall, in time for the holidays.”

The Tweed Cartoons

“And the [William "Boss"] Tweed pictures?”

“Yes, it is arranged they shall follow. I shall begin on these as soon as the holiday book is out, and they will be ready for the press some time in 1888.”

“Have you others in contemplation?”

“I have had a good many letters,” replied the caricaturist. “asking me to have my war pictures reproduced. But they could not appear before 1889, and so I have not made any plans concerning them.”

The conversation then turned to political subjects, and the Morning News observed, good-naturedly, that since their last meeting Mr. Nast had become a Democrat.

“I am a [Grover] Cleveland man,” he said, significantly. And then he added, laughingly, “I am a Mugwump.”

“Tell me,” requested the Morning News, “how and why it was that you, who had always been so aggressive and effective a Republican, came to be a Cleveland man. I know that many people are equally curious with me upon that subject, and I should like, if you do not seriously object, to ask you the question journalistically, for publication.”

“I am not very fond of being interviewed.” said the artist, but I could not refuse to answer a question like that, and you are welcome to publish it if you care to do so.

“I was an [Chester A.] Arthur man at first. He had given the country an honest and very respectable administration and I thought it the proper thing to nominate him next. [James G.] Blaine it was impossible for me to support. My pictures during several years preceding that time were to that effect. Although I must say that I was glad the time had come and the man to feel safe under, to prove that the country could go on as smoothly even under another party’s administration.

“It was sad to think that this great, free country could be ruled with safety only by one political party. I did not like that idea and I did not believe it.

“Then, I was tired of old issues. I thought it was time to discuss issues other than the war, and the South, and the bloody shirt. Mr. [Henry W.] Grady, at the New England banquet, spoke of the New South, but he forgot to mention that we also had a new North. The North has set its face to the future. It is tired of dead issues and ancient history. “And,” said Mr. Nast very vigorously, “the election of Cleveland has accomplished just what I most desired.”

“You are very well satisfied, then, with the situation?”

“Yes, decidedly so. I think it plain enough that the South is much better off; more tranquil and better satisfied. The negro feels perfectly free. His mind is emancipated. He knows that his rights are secure whichever way he votes, and nearly all the Republicans concede that the country is safe in its present hands and that we can now enter into rational politics, peace and prosperity.”

Nast A Free Trader

“Can you talk about the tariff:” inquired the reporter laughing.

“Yes,” exclaimed the artist with vivacity, knowing that he was addressing a protective tariff man; “even the time may now soon come when we can agree before the people the question of protection to monopolies and tariff reform for the consumer and the people at large.”

“Do you think it probable that Mr. Cleveland will be renominated?”

“Yes; the Democrats have a reputation for making blunders, but it is not reasonable to suppose that they will fail to renominate the man who not only gave them success, but has, by his wise and prudent course, reconciled all conservative men to their party. Mr. Cleveland was stronger than his party, and he is much stronger now than when he carried the country for the Democracy in 1884. He has made one of the best Presidents the country ever had.”

“Would the Mugwumps support Cleveland as heartily as they did before?”

“Why of course they would, and a good deal more numerously, for the Mugwump party is growing all the time. Yes sir, you may be sure that Cleveland will succeed himself, and at any rate, I shall do everything in my power to have it so.”

“How would it be with you,” the Morning News inquired, “if [David B.]Hill should be the nominee?”

“I would not support him. I am not that kind of a ‘Democrat.’”

“Would you in that case, support the Republican candidate?”

“If he was the right kind of man I would. Yes, certainly. If the Democratic candidate should be Hill or any Democrat of the same sort and the Republicans should put up a clean, honest man I should support the Republican.”

“What if,” asked the reporter, smiling, “it should be Hill against Blaine?”

“In that case,” said Mr. Nast, with much animation, “there would be no difficultly in my getting a leave of absence for six months to visit Europe for my health. I think, though, that in such an event there would be a third party in the field-and it might get whipped-but we would try real hard.”

Mr. Nast was sounded on the labor question, and said he wanted labor to get its rights, but not by violating the law.

“Ours is a government of law,’ said Mr. Nast; “any labor organization that does not allow that individual liberty which our Constitution guarantees is a rebel to the government, and the men who do these things would, if successful, create the worst slavery that ever existed.”

The conversation took various flight, but came at last to Washington and the President again.

“There is a deal of dubious talk about Mr. Cleveland’s physical condition,” remarked the Morning News. What do you think about it?”

“I saw him in Washington as I came through.” said Mr. Nast, “and interviews with him on two occasions. I never saw him looking better. I do not credit any of the stories about his bad health.”

“Did you meet Mrs. Cleveland?”

“Yes Mrs. Nast and I called on her. It was the first time we ever met her. It was the first time we had ever met her, and we were both very much pleased. She is so exceedingly, so charmingly unaffected, so natural in her manners. I cannot exactly describe to you what it is that captivates every one so completely, but she is of course a person of rare good sense and greatness of heart, and in addition to her natural qualities she adds admirable training.”

“While we were calling she asked us if we would not like to witness a public reception by the President. Of course we did want to, and she arranged a place for us so that we saw everything, and the president did not know we were there until afterward.

At The White House

“We expected to see something amusing, but were disappointed. It was a very impressive affair. The people were seated in the room and waited until the hour for the President to appear, when he came in with one or two attendants and the people rose and went out, each one being received by the President as he or she did so. It was the most intensely democratic sight I have ever seen; the President of the nation receiving and speaking with the people. His manner-” Here Mr. Nast jumped from his chair and proceeded to illustrate it.

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Discussion Questions

1. What is a mugwump?

2. What reasons did Nast give for supporting Cleveland over Blaine?

3. Would Nast support any Democrat candidate? Why or why not?

4. As a historical source, is this interview reliable and useful to modern readers? Why or why not?

5. In your perspective, what was more important to Nast: staying loyal to political party lines or supporting political values?